Let's talk about specialists balance

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    • Let's talk about specialists balance

      Hi everyone!
      I'm a polish player and I've been collecting feedback on the latest SP update. How did the english community accept it? Do you still think that changes are needed? I invite you to the discussion.
      Grzegorz Brzęczyszczykiewicz. Chrząszczyżewoszyce powiatu Łękołody. :)
    • Im glad you bring this up,i was just wondering on creating a thread like this.
      Let's start with mages.
      First,with those that got the most superficial changes.
      Red Mage and Blue Mage.
      So Red Mage had absolutely 0 change in his skills,except mana transfusion(ill bring that later).
      The only thing i hardly notice is that the basic attack is aoe and isn't 45 mp anymore but 40 mp.This dosen't help at all because it's still the only tier 1 mage sp that have the highest mana consumption from the basic attack and the only other change that happen for him is lowered mana use for ultimate and thats all.
      And thats a shame,this card needed a new design the most,thanks God for the CT reduction so RM finally can do PVE.
      Though Red Mage had it kinda bad,there is acttualy one that had it worst and thats Blue Mage.
      The only thing that got changed with him was the CT and they made the basic aoe and thats all,Yay.
      Atleast they did Holy Mage right.
      Finally my holy dosen't have 2 usseles spells that sits in bar and are good for nothing.(Heaven Song and Undead purge).
      Heaven song got a cool new design,10 seconds shock is very handy and acttualy i wouldn't mind if it was a stun. :D
      Undead Purge also got Holy Shield which is very nice,10 second immune to crit is very good in PVP.
      The cure restores mana too,it's nice because while you use a small portion of mana to cast cure you gain 10 times more back,thats awesome. :thumbup:
      Holy weapon kept his proprieties and also gain melee/remote/magic attack dmg increase which is very usseful for a group. :thumbsup:
      However now it get's bad.
      Blessing no longer offers crit protection and instead it gives 5 overall res and some defense to melee/remote attacks.
      No,im not an arena user that abuse his alts but Crit protection for 5 minutes was a + that compensate the inutility of HS and UP and it was a very usseful buff.We got already a 10 sec individual crit prot buff but they could had made it longer too since it's individual.
      Then is the overall change in Mages magic shields.
      Mana Transfusion,Mana Shield and Ghost Guard got a 30% hp heal like shield with the cost of consuming mana and also with the cost of REDUCING 20% DAMAGE.
      I don't like this ideea,i think they should probably make it a bigger mana consumption and let the damage unchanged.It bassicaly ruins the point of using this shield anymore in PVP.
      Going back to holy.
      Aside from what i said there isn't anymore major change,Holy Hammer stayed the same,Holy Light debuff now makes the target to receive a crit with the probability of 60%,BECAUSE MAGES CAN CRIT APPARENTLY,and i assume the healing spells were improved at healing which is not bad.
      Overall i like the new Holy Mage,there were some changes that didn't make any sense,but i preffer this new holy rather then the old one.
      I can't say anything about DG because i didn't played as one.
      For Seer and TL,idc,these sp's were already kinda broken and i feel like they made them more broken with these new upgrades but whatever.
      Archers sp's changes were very minor except for assasin which they completly remake.
      For swordies,i don't know much,i know that some Sader skills got remade,Growth shield acttualy have a purpose now and protects you from crits for 10 seconds,while while some other debuff and buffs decrease/increase the crit like Holy Breath and Triple charging,they are fine i guess.
      But anyway for a mage point of view im not 100% satisfied.
      Say what you feel,it's not being rude.It's being real.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Pinkamena ().

    • Let me talk about the warrior changes here in both PVE and PVP situation.
      (Why only war? because the other swordie's sps change are really not that important and is fine in my opinion, still not special after all the changes)

      Provoke
      First of all, the new provoke skill is a great improvement for PVE and its fine though it's quite annoying in PVP.
      It works out quite well for both lvling and raids, and the only problem is that it still isn't working on some flying lod monsters and Bacoom in act6.
      Tide lord therefore do better job than war in terms of provoking.
      Nonetheless the skill has became the best choice for fast cleaning and protecting teammates.

      Iron Skin and Shoulder Charge
      The remaining changes are for the skill Iron Skin and Shoulder Charge, and the change of the former really confuses me a lot.
      Clearly the purpose of these two changes is to act as a complete counter-play to hit-and-run archer(its really obvious), and the effect is significant(if not considering enemy being fully buffed up and having a Lucifer, they are just cancer and can beat anything in fc). What I though is the skill has been specialized for PVP only which is a pity because war is the first SP that you will get.

      Btw, the improvement of Shoulder Charge is fine because there's a lot of ways to lower the chance of having blackout instead of 100%.

      However, after the change war actually perform worse in PVE. Iron skin's damage reduction is totally useless once you get enough defense power and res due to the damage cap. It is easy to gather enough defense power and res by simply buffing and SPs upgrading in PVE. Before, the skill has magic damage reduction which is good because swordie's magic defense is the lowest among three classes.
      And for the new cool time reduction, the effect is just so small due to the fact that you have to frequently rebuff which really cost you time to do that.

      One more important thing I want to address is that we seldom see people using war to lvl,
      even though war's skill set is good for lvling with provoke and aoe shock.
      Actually swordie's tankiness in PVE IS WORSE THAN MAGE, also their ability to fully recover themselves.
      The main reason will be because of the MP barrier(MP barrier is one of the few ability that can lower the damage after reaching damage cap) and the damage cap
      It is really confusing to see that holy mage outperforms war in lod in terms of luring and tanking,
      simply because holy mage have a much easier life to heal themselves to full hp just by eating snacks and HP/MP potions lol.
      In other situation, it is just too expensive for war to tank the damage. Pet/partner dolls are much better option than 100%HP potion when you need to fight monster non-stop.

      Now war is basically only for countering archer, morale buff and provoking in raids
      My suggestion is simply adding or replacing the cool time reduction by reducing chance of having all negative effect by 25%-35%,
      and lower the range damage reduction to 40%-50% but compensate with a all res buff 8-12
      In this way it will be more feasible in PVE, and not so op in PVP because the buff still won't last long and you have to sacrifice attacking chance for rebuffing. War will never be OP in attacking with those slowwwwwwwwwwwww skill action
      (at least blade and serk has been compensated by high crit chance and high damage per attack respectively, and Yes those casting time reduction does't help increasing the speed at all honestly)

      To be honest swordie has a lot of issues including the 90lvl up eqs, character's base stats and the very basic disadvantage of being a melee,
      and I believe it is quite difficult to do the balance work only by changing the SPs.


      P.S. The damage cap is around the monster lvl*5, this happens after act1
      e.g. Not considering element damage, 75lv Monster with 750 attack power will always hit you 75*5=375 even your defense power is higher than 375

      This game actually has a lot of hidden mechanics that you have to figure it out by yourself(mainly the actual damage calculation, it's ****ingly complicated)
      Knowing the mechanics really helps you to outperform the others, and also makes the game more interesting to play:)


      And the actual effect of morale buff will remain mysterious forever I guess....

    • Pinkamena wrote:

      Im glad you bring this up,i was just wondering on creating a thread like this.
      Let's start with mages.
      First,with those that got the most superficial changes.
      Red Mage and Blue Mage.
      So Red Mage had absolutely 0 change in his skills,except mana transfusion(ill bring that later).
      The only thing i hardly notice is that the basic attack is aoe and isn't 45 mp anymore but 40 mp.This dosen't help at all because it's still the only tier 1 mage sp that have the highest mana consumption from the basic attack and the only other change that happen for him is lowered mana use for ultimate and thats all.
      And thats a shame,this card needed a new design the most,thanks God for the CT reduction so RM finally can do PVE.
      Though Red Mage had it kinda bad,there is acttualy one that had it worst and thats Blue Mage.
      The only thing that got changed with him was the CT and they made the basic aoe and thats all,Yay.
      Atleast they did Holy Mage right.
      Finally my holy dosen't have 2 usseles spells that sits in bar and are good for nothing.(Heaven Song and Undead purge).
      Heaven song got a cool new design,10 seconds shock is very handy and acttualy i wouldn't mind if it was a stun. :D
      Undead Purge also got Holy Shield which is very nice,10 second immune to crit is very good in PVP.
      The cure restores mana too,it's nice because while you use a small portion of mana to cast cure you gain 10 times more back,thats awesome. :thumbup:
      Holy weapon kept his proprieties and also gain melee/remote/magic attack dmg increase which is very usseful for a group. :thumbsup:
      However now it get's bad.
      Blessing no longer offers crit protection and instead it gives 5 overall res and some defense to melee/remote attacks.
      No,im not an arena user that abuse his alts but Crit protection for 5 minutes was a + that compensate the inutility of HS and UP and it was a very usseful buff.We got already a 10 sec individual crit prot buff but they could had made it longer too since it's invidual.
      Then is the overall change in Mages magic shields.
      Mana Transfusion,Mana Shield and Ghost Guard got a 30% hp heal like shield with the cost of consuming mana and also with the cost of REDUCING 20% DAMAGE.
      I don't like this ideea,i think they should probably make it a bigger mana consumption and let the damage unchanged.It bassicaly ruins the point of using this shield anymore in PVP.
      Going back to holy.
      Aside from what i said there isn't anymore major change,Holy Hammer stayed the same,Holy Light debuff now makes the target to receive a crit with the probability of 60%,BECAUSE MAGES CAN CRIT APPARENTLY,and i assume the healing spells were improved at healing which is not bad.
      Overall i like the new Holy Mage,there were some changes that didn't make any sense,but i preffer this new holy rather then the old one.
      I can't say anything about DG because i didn't played as one.
      For Seer and TL,idc,these sp's were already kinda broken and i feel like they made them more broken with these new upgrades but whatever.
      Archers sp's changes were very minor except for assasin which they completly remake.
      For swordies,i don't know much,i know that some Sader skills got remade,Growth shield acttualy have a purpose now and protects you from crits for 10 seconds,while while some other debuff and buffs decrease/increase the crit like Holy Breath and Triple charging,they are fine i guess.
      But anyway for a mage point of view im not 100% satisfied.
      Sorry, just a lurker in this forum. Came here to clarify some misunderstanding about mage sps.

      Mage mana shields reduce the damage of the opponent by 20%, not the user. Thus, it is HIGHLY recommended to use shield in pvp due to the lower mana consumption (compared to the previous shields) and better damage mitigation. Some mage specialists, however, do not have the 20% damage mitigation. If they increase the mana consumption, then mages would need a significant amount of mana to compete with others. Either way, without the shield, mages would probably die very quickly.

      Red Mage actually got lower cool downs, and the mp usage is one of the least of all mage sps. While I agree that Blue Mage could use some other buffs because they don't have mana shield, they still have a 10 cool down "block" and a hella lot of stun locks. Both sps also have decent damage multipliers (the magic damage increase and elemental damage increase). Although they might not do well in pvp, they excel in specific pve areas.

      Holy Mage got nerfed in their party buffs, but that really doesn't affect them. They still benefited tremendously with this patch, which Pinkamena agrees with.

      For things that Pinkamena did not mention:

      Dark Gunner is broken in pvp. The only mage sp I wish they would nerf a bit. The debuffs eat other buffs and rip through hp, the skills have high damage multipliers, low mana consumption, crit buffs/ele buffs etc etc. Having a solid dark gunner makes 1v1 VERY difficult for the opponent, and dark gunner could basically be seen as a counter for all other mage sps (probably not Holy). It is arguable that this specialist is seen as the same tier with Scout and Battle Monk.

      Volcano is slightly shafted to be focused on pvp. Outshined by DG, Tide Lord, and Seer, but still viable. The mp usage is insane, however, and it does less ele damage than Red Mage due to the lack of the elemental buff. Volc still does well with their unique resistance downs and stuns, and they can still dish out good damage. Unfortunately, pve is less forgiving towards them, and they lack the party buffs necessary to be kept in raids. Who needs focus these days?

      Tide Lord is one of the higher tier sps for mages. Great buffs, decent cooldowns, and amazing utility for both pvp/pve. Their provoke captures even flying units, providing better usage than Warrior's provoke. They have sing to sleep opponents and allow them to wait for cd or recover some hp/mp. Their buff increases defense, and allows (very low but useful) debuff immunity. Their skills are mostly luck based, but they could lower the opponent's resistance and completely eat enemies' mana (pretty low chance, but can happen commonly). The only problem that Tide Lords face is damage, which can be fixed with equips and SP points.

      Seer is another Mage god pvp. Second to probably dark gunner (still argued to be first), this specialist probably does better in group pvps. They essentially have a "second life," in which they can survive any hits for 14 seconds (the buff can be deleted by the opponent however). Great debuffs that increases the opponents cool down and limits movement. Skills do decent damage. Great buff that increases speed and defense. Their final skill has a minute cooldown, that's REALLY low. Only problem is the insane mp usage, but that's really common in sp5+ specialists.

      Arch Mage is what I say is a top tier flawed sp. On paper, they have skills that are almost useless. Meteor, although it hits enemies more than people think, does very low damage. And it costs SO much mana while having a long cool down. Their teleport consumes huge amounts of mana as well; this skill can be helpful, but I mostly saw it for trolling or Instant Combat. Heal is broken in both ways, with guaranteed full hp every 10 MINUTES. Their buffs are pretty good, but Fast Lane (a similar charge to Sader's Triple Charge) only boosts damage for one skill. On practice, Arch Mage is amazing. VERY LOW COOL DOWNS for their attacking skills. The debuffs can decrease light resistance, prevent the opponent from attacking, double the damage of another skill (like an explosion), and slow the enemies down. For PVE, this should be the specialist mages should focus on (other than Tide Lord and the specific elemental sps).

      In summary:
      Mages need someway to fix their defense, which is technically their mana. Lower levels suffer from these areas, but once players reach lv 93, they gain abnormal increases in mana. Everything depends on equips and shells, etc obviously. But just counting Specialists, most mage players should focus on Arch Mage or Tide Lord first before focusing anywhere else. After the patch, all mage specialists are better than decent. There isn't a "destroyer" or "demon reaper" tier of mage specialist. You don't need to work TOO much harder than others to get a solid mage specialist.

      Edits:
      *I lied, all mage specialists should have the 20% damage decrease in receiving. There are some mage specialists that decrease damage even further.
      *I may not talk for the majority. I really appreciate arguments and criticisms!
      *I'll do one for swordy as well.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Senoh23 ().

    • I rechecked it and it's true,it is acttualy applied on the target and not on himself.
      The description was lazy though,It said "Decrease the damage by 20%" on a buff,thx God i noticed the white writing which said that it applies to the target.
      Then i take back everything i said about mage shields. X/ BTW by low tier i meant sp 1-4 and high tier sp 5-8.
      After doing some research,i can surely tell you that RM was and still remains the card with the most mp usage from first 4.(Im not talking about sp 5-8).Which is bad because this is the first card that mage's will encounter.
      Basic attack :
      RM>BM>DG>HOLY.
      40>30>10>0.
      Ultimate ability :
      RM>BM>DG>HOLY.
      450>400>360>145.
      This also goes for the rest of the skills,it seems the mp reduction isnt visibile at all,the holy mage remains the card with the least mana usage and friendliest to newbies,with the new good changes happening to him,it's doing very great.
      While i appreciate the cooldown and cast time reduction and mostly cast time reduction because it dosen't feel slow anymore,the problem persists with his skills.
      He have 5 debuffs overall.2 Stuns,2 Burns which are bassicaly small dots with some fire res drop,togheter they form 45%,prior to 2016 it was 30% and finally WDP which decrease the defense level by 2.
      However these debuffs aren't that great.
      One of his stun is 40%,and both of them are blackout whch is the weakest form of stun as there are many items that reduce the % threat including a lv 18 Hippo Hat,leaving him with only one viable stun via his ultimate which is a 80% blackout and is more likely to hit.The burns are ussefull only for lower levels as most likely they don't have over 100% fire res to counter them,while WDP remains the only usseful debuff for a RM regardless of his level.Forcing him to rely on his buffs to deal damage.
      The Blue Mage on the other hand have 5 stuns (where 3 are freezers) and is the most powerfull in early stages,however because of his horribile long cooldown,if you can't manage to kill a high level in less then 8 spells,you will find yourself praying for the cd's to be over while the opponent will kill you.In my oppinion you shouldnt consider pvp with a BM but if you do,reconsider your choice if you are fighting a Seer.
      As i said im not aware of the Dark Gunner changes as i never liked this card and never bother playing him before 2016 update.He battled Red Mage for the worst Mage card in my oppinion.
      First,theoretically they had 6 debuffs but acctualy 5 because Possesion and Potion of Evil wont stack togheter for some odd reason,probably they consider having a slow and a lifesteal on the same time was broken,i beg to differ but whatever.Anyway from these 6,3 were Dot's,1 was stun,1 was slow and 1 was dark res drop.
      While the stun and the res drop weren't that bad,the dots were,as only Requiem was acttualy of any use because the lifesteal from the Potion of Evil was too low,the Plague was too hard to apply because it came from ultimate which was a close attack and was only 60%.While the Requiem was also a close attack but hey atleast it was 100%. :phatgrin:
      The ultimate itself wasn't much of a help because DG's excelled at remote dmg and didn't have any strong shield to protect him from dmg whatsoever.
      By the way you are describing DG right now,i think it's whort a shot.
      While Volc dosen't have fire blessing but it compensates with a lot of other things that makes him stronger overall,like tons of stuns and high speed for example.However it just feels boring to me duw to the fact that is similar too the other sp 5 too much.Besides if a mage isn't a TL is a Volcano.
      Archmage is my guilty pleasure,i know its weak,never played one but i wish i could on the US server.They just feels so different from your average bursty mage sp and aren't overused.The fact that their ultimate is not an attacking ability,i mean yeah the cooldown is long as hell but you can always relog for pvp. :lol:
      It also can work like Seer ilusion in pvp,the massive teleporting is also nice,We have an actual mage card that can teleport finally ! I also like their design,they also use books as weapons ! :D
      Say what you feel,it's not being rude.It's being real.
    • Yo, you bring up some good points about red mage. I actually thought the skills had less mana usage than usually, but that's probably because I was comparing them with volcano. Lower mage levels definitely suffer from this; it's been a while since I experienced a real lack of mana.

      Also, no one should consider red mage or blue mage for pvp. Unfortunately, they can only go too well, but the later sps just outshine them. They have their niche specialty in pve, but...yeah.

      Dark gunner is as fast as seers. Plus 4 speed from their defense buff alone. Crit buffs. Etc. You name it, he basically has it. Their mana usage is incredibly low compared to seers as well. However, I believe both of them are amazing.

      Glad to see someone liking Arch mage though! Uh, I saw a lot in act 5+, but I guess it isn't as common as tide lords.

      And yeah, seers are awesome haha. Annoying, yet super fun.

      I would enjoy if someone experienced could do a detailed summary of the swordy sps though. I have all of them as well, but I never played each one as much as I did with mage sps.
    • @GoddessLuna

      Yes! Archer specialists, from sp1 to 4, did change a little. Although I don't have much details, I can briefly put down some information.

      Rangers got a slight buff towards their buffs, in which affects most of their attacking skills. Lowered cool downs, slight defense mitigation (I think, like a bushi costume), boosted damage (mostly for range), and slightly increased hit rate. Honestly, not much changed for Rangers, and they're still pretty good until Wild Keeper.

      Assassin had some weird nerfs and buffs. For starters, their significant crit buff became 5 second duration and 40 second cool down. Literally a "got to kill now" buff. It is nerfed, but it's really powerful in the little time you have. Other than that, they got relative cool down reductions to almost all their skills, and still has good overall damage. The biggest nerf I say is that their charge isn't guaranteed, but it's still...decent. Honestly, sins needed a nerf, but they got reaaaaally shafted lol.

      Destroyers are generally the "skip" specialist for archers, but I had a lot of fun with it. Their buffs are geared mostly towards pvp, which unfortunately does NOT assist them. They're fast, but their defense capabilities don't apply in pve. The problem with them is not really their damage skills (they're pretty good), but rather that their buffs don't assist them much. Lowkey should be used for like ic drops or archer substitute for vsing water elements.

      Wild keeper is still broken. Honestly, idk what you want to learn. If you want to accepted anywhere, just boost your wild keeper. It's arguably on the highest tier in pve specialists and pretty good in pvp as well. Seriously. Want to be good? Just focus on wild keeper. Unless pvp, then go whatever sp5+.

      @Lou

      There are some specialists I would like to boost: assassins, warrior (very little), demon reaper, destroyer, etc. Honestly, it's just nitpicky stuff! All of the specialists can be used well, it's just rather troublesome to focus on a specialist that is entirely overshadowed by another. Also, some skills could use more/less cool downs, slight damage distributions, duration boosts, etc. Little things could make a specialist go far.

      However, there should be a fine line between buffing to get the sp as good as others, or nerfing slightly for the sp to be balanced. Unfortunately, balancing in nos is like trying to completely tame a raccoon. A slight change could boost a specialist to top tier in no time, but a slight nerf could send the specialist to "never used." In conclusion, I'll say the patch right now is satisfactory. There is a clear distinction between "good" and "bad" specialists, but the first four specialists usually do well against the later specialists, and that was technically the point of the patch. Lowkey, it's not about the specialist, but it's about those lv 90+ champion level equips. Get those, balance technically means nothing.
    • Senoh23 wrote:

      @GoddessLuna

      Yes! Archer specialists, from sp1 to 4, did change a little. Although I don't have much details, I can briefly put down some information.

      Rangers got a slight buff towards their buffs, in which affects most of their attacking skills. Lowered cool downs, slight defense mitigation (I think, like a bushi costume), boosted damage (mostly for range), and slightly increased hit rate. Honestly, not much changed for Rangers, and they're still pretty good until Wild Keeper.

      Assassin had some weird nerfs and buffs. For starters, their significant crit buff became 5 second duration and 40 second cool down. Literally a "got to kill now" buff. It is nerfed, but it's really powerful in the little time you have. Other than that, they got relative cool down reductions to almost all their skills, and still has good overall damage. The biggest nerf I say is that their charge isn't guaranteed, but it's still...decent. Honestly, sins needed a nerf, but they got reaaaaally shafted lol.

      Destroyers are generally the "skip" specialist for archers, but I had a lot of fun with it. Their buffs are geared mostly towards pvp, which unfortunately does NOT assist them. They're fast, but their defense capabilities don't apply in pve. The problem with them is not really their damage skills (they're pretty good), but rather that their buffs don't assist them much. Lowkey should be used for like ic drops or archer substitute for vsing water elements.

      Wild keeper is still broken. Honestly, idk what you want to learn. If you want to accepted anywhere, just boost your wild keeper. It's arguably on the highest tier in pve specialists and pretty good in pvp as well. Seriously. Want to be good? Just focus on wild keeper. Unless pvp, then go whatever sp5+.

      @Lou

      There are some specialists I would like to boost: assassins, warrior (very little), demon reaper, destroyer, etc. Honestly, it's just nitpicky stuff! All of the specialists can be used well, it's just rather troublesome to focus on a specialist that is entirely overshadowed by another. Also, some skills could use more/less cool downs, slight damage distributions, duration boosts, etc. Little things could make a specialist go far.

      However, there should be a fine line between buffing to get the sp as good as others, or nerfing slightly for the sp to be balanced. Unfortunately, balancing in nos is like trying to completely tame a raccoon. A slight change could boost a specialist to top tier in no time, but a slight nerf could send the specialist to "never used." In conclusion, I'll say the patch right now is satisfactory. There is a clear distinction between "good" and "bad" specialists, but the first four specialists usually do well against the later specialists, and that was technically the point of the patch. Lowkey, it's not about the specialist, but it's about those lv 90+ champion level equips. Get those, balance technically means nothing.
      Sad to hear about the sin nerfs but I understand why. Des was always poor in my opinion and I always skipped getting that sp. Nice to know that WK is still top dog in LoD and PvE stuff xD! Wk is my favorite sp anyways. Thank you for all your information!
    • Senoh23 wrote:

      @GoddessLuna

      Yes! Archer specialists, from sp1 to 4, did change a little. Although I don't have much details, I can briefly put down some information.

      Rangers got a slight buff towards their buffs, in which affects most of their attacking skills. Lowered cool downs, slight defense mitigation (I think, like a bushi costume), boosted damage (mostly for range), and slightly increased hit rate. Honestly, not much changed for Rangers, and they're still pretty good until Wild Keeper.

      Assassin had some weird nerfs and buffs. For starters, their significant crit buff became 5 second duration and 40 second cool down. Literally a "got to kill now" buff. It is nerfed, but it's really powerful in the little time you have. Other than that, they got relative cool down reductions to almost all their skills, and still has good overall damage. The biggest nerf I say is that their charge isn't guaranteed, but it's still...decent. Honestly, sins needed a nerf, but they got reaaaaally shafted lol.

      Destroyers are generally the "skip" specialist for archers, but I had a lot of fun with it. Their buffs are geared mostly towards pvp, which unfortunately does NOT assist them. They're fast, but their defense capabilities don't apply in pve. The problem with them is not really their damage skills (they're pretty good), but rather that their buffs don't assist them much. Lowkey should be used for like ic drops or archer substitute for vsing water elements.

      Wild keeper is still broken. Honestly, idk what you want to learn. If you want to accepted anywhere, just boost your wild keeper. It's arguably on the highest tier in pve specialists and pretty good in pvp as well. Seriously. Want to be good? Just focus on wild keeper. Unless pvp, then go whatever sp5+.

      @Lou

      There are some specialists I would like to boost: assassins, warrior (very little), demon reaper, destroyer, etc. Honestly, it's just nitpicky stuff! All of the specialists can be used well, it's just rather troublesome to focus on a specialist that is entirely overshadowed by another. Also, some skills could use more/less cool downs, slight damage distributions, duration boosts, etc. Little things could make a specialist go far.

      However, there should be a fine line between buffing to get the sp as good as others, or nerfing slightly for the sp to be balanced. Unfortunately, balancing in nos is like trying to completely tame a raccoon. A slight change could boost a specialist to top tier in no time, but a slight nerf could send the specialist to "never used." In conclusion, I'll say the patch right now is satisfactory. There is a clear distinction between "good" and "bad" specialists, but the first four specialists usually do well against the later specialists, and that was technically the point of the patch. Lowkey, it's not about the specialist, but it's about those lv 90+ champion level equips. Get those, balance technically means nothing.
      Acttualy :
      Wild Keeper is the only sp card from tier 1 sp's that hadn't been changed with absolutely nothing during the patch update in 2016.
      Also yes,you are right,they are broken in PVE but extremly weak in PVP.
      If you don't lend a succesfull ED aka Elemental Leech,then you are dead.Taking in account that 16 sp's use remote damage while other melee have some tricks to avoid ED,you are preety much a goner.
      Destroyer have only 1 single skill change,the cure no longer cures but give a 15% dmg increase in PVP while also give a 15% chance to reduce all of the incoming damage by 90%.
      Now,nobody question the ussefulnes of this ability,it is indeed a nice boost in PVP but it's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too few for such an unpopular card like destroyer,it also dosen't make it viable in PVP either.
      Ranger got 2 improved buffs,Hawk Eye and Rapid Fire,more or less usseful,Hawk eye upgrade is really pointless honestly,15% chance to reduce 15% incoming dmg is meh,Rapid Fire however is significally stronger,10% chance to reduce 90% incoming dmg is quite strong and when you add lowering cooldowns it makes it even better then Hawk Eye.Range Boost also got 2 points longer which is great and thats all.
      LMAO,Assasins had nerfs ?
      Did you acctualy saw the page of the assasins and what they changed ?
      None of the former Assasins spells got removed but reduced however they got tons of new abilities which makes them broken af.
      Lets start with his buff,Critical hit initially had only one stat and that was 50% chance to crit.
      After the change the crit chance became 30% with Pact of darkness however 4 buffs were also added :
      Pact of Darkness - Reduce all skills cooldown by 50%.
      Sinister Shadow - Pvp dmg increased by 10%.
      - 80% chance to ignore 30% of target defense.
      - 80% chance of reducing the crit received by 30%.
      Now i know the duration is only for 4 seconds but you only need a hit for this wonder to apply.Coldown of this ability is also reduced with 20 seconds.
      Slash and Storm Slash kept their abilities but now they also deal additional damage when are invisibile.
      Thick Smog got upgraded from 30% chance to hit the target to 50%,it also got a new buff that makes him to always dodge the target for a probability of 80%.
      If this was a "nerf" it was very superficial,the shock chance become 60% instead of 70%,the charge become 80% instead of 100%,(which let's be honest is still 100%) but also the ultimate got a 80% charge too.
      Now the only thing i agree to be a nerf for the assasin is Shadow Hide aka invisibility as now the duration is somewhere beetwen 10 to 50 seconds,i wish they just put a fixed number here.
      Ofc these strong buffs are no longer then 4 seconds each but any capable player can use them in their advantage.Aside from the Shadow Hide they make sin a PVP beast this patch,he can takedown even bigger guys like Scouts and Avenging Angels.
      Say what you feel,it's not being rude.It's being real.

      The post was edited 5 times, last by Pinkamena ().

    • @Pinkamena

      For wk, yeah. PVE hype haha

      For assassins,
      I guess that's true, but honestly, that is 4 seconds in a long lasting pvp battle. Lowkey I don't see them taking down scouts, but I do see them taking down avenging angels. I just don't see aa's that dominate in pvp due to the spawn of warriors and battle monks, but...

      ...Truth be told, yeah I don't have much on assassin experience in pvp. All the sins around my lv (85-90) do terribly, and once they hit 90+, almost all specialists do "well." What I meant by nerf is that sins became really luck based after the patch. You get unlucky with the buff, didn't get a charge, then you're gonna eat some huge hits before you can retaliate. Due to the insane dodge rates in shells these days (and many buffs that decrease crit damage), a person has to invest in a lot more money into sins compared to scouts or cs's. Seriously though, I just can't see assassins as the top tier of pvp anymore due to how many pvp sps are in nos these days. Maybe my comparison is unfair, due to my experiences seeing dg/seer/tl/monk/scout etc so many times, but I do think that an average capable player needs a heckin more experience to use sins rather than the other ones.

      Then again, maybe that's what makes them amazing. I love sins, just never saw them utilized to their full potential after patch. I'll try to research more on them. Thanks for the perspective!
    • Hello

      I have some comments on mage ^^

      DG:
      Poison: The percentage of the buffs is too high

      Seer:
      The ultimate's damage is not POWERFUL enough.
      it takes 2000 MP and the damage is low

      Archmage
      The weakest shield of mage , can't imagine it is a sp8
      They should increase the defense of the shield
      Increase the damage of the Meteorites and making stun when it hits the characters
      SKill 5, the effect will not disappear when you attack, remove the reduction of MP of level 3 as the sp 3 warrior
      Also, reduce the cold down of the shield, Meteorites and heal (The ultimate)

      Thank you
    • I honestly hate how they changed Sin. For PvE he is practically useless now.

      Now I understand, Sin was never meant to be for PvE but there still are players like me who HATE PvP and used sin for stealthing away in PTS or when there were a lot of enemies you'd not be able to battle against. Now that they completely nerfed his stealth I can not use him at all. EVEN JAJAMARU HAS A LONGER STEALTH, like come on. At least make the stealth as long as the cooldown, so you can't abuse invisibility for 4 mins but instead have to press it every 25 seconds which seems more fair. With 10 seconds - which is what I usually get - I can practically not do anything. And if someone says the "porting makes up for it" I'll eat a broom. I just want to be able to use Sin for PvE again. Same for Blade, I just feel like they are utterly useless and most Players will choose Monk/Scout.

      Then again I'd hope they'd nerf and tweak some things but will Gameforge/Entwell do anything about it? I doubt it. Not for now at least. I mean there's still bugs around from 2008, but hey - at least they changed "Pooh Pooh Hat" to "Funny Fish Hat" :lol: (... rip Pooh Pooh Hat 2008 - 2017 ;w;)

      Just my two cents.
    • Syru wrote:

      I honestly hate how they changed Sin. For PvE he is practically useless now.

      Now I understand, Sin was never meant to be for PvE but there still are players like me who HATE PvP and used sin for stealthing away in PTS or when there were a lot of enemies you'd not be able to battle against. Now that they completely nerfed his stealth I can not use him at all. EVEN JAJAMARU HAS A LONGER STEALTH, like come on. At least make the stealth as long as the cooldown, so you can't abuse invisibility for 4 mins but instead have to press it every 25 seconds which seems more fair. With 10 seconds - which is what I usually get - I can practically not do anything. And if someone says the "porting makes up for it" I'll eat a broom. I just want to be able to use Sin for PvE again. Same for Blade, I just feel like they are utterly useless and most Players will choose Monk/Scout.

      Then again I'd hope they'd nerf and tweak some things but will Gameforge/Entwell do anything about it? I doubt it. Not for now at least. I mean there's still bugs around from 2008, but hey - at least they changed "Pooh Pooh Hat" to "Funny Fish Hat" :lol: (... rip Pooh Pooh Hat 2008 - 2017 ;w;)

      Just my two cents.
      For someone that did any raids,relying on sin invisibility to do the buttons,i completly understand you,i was complaining about this too when the 2016 update happen.
      The Spider raid became too hard right now,that is ridiculous,they should atleast put sin invisibility a solid 50 seconds.
      Say what you feel,it's not being rude.It's being real.
    • The Polish community believes that the Destroyer, the Reaper, the Archmage and Blue Mages need further changes that can change those cards for the better. You should also keep in mind SP6 which are Over Power (or at least that is my opinion).
      Grzegorz Brzęczyszczykiewicz. Chrząszczyżewoszyce powiatu Łękołody. :)
    • Hello again, friends. I would like to present you the ideas invented by Polish players NosTale, of course you can express your opinions on them.
      Destroyer:
      All skills have a range of 10 cells, a duration of 0.0s (except bombs where 0.3s. Ultimate skill - 0.5s).
      1st skill: CD 7.0s -> 10.0s. With a probability of 15% can trigger Stun (3l bad effect, 3.0s)
      6th skill: CD 23.0s -> 15.0s. With a probability of 30% can trigger Stun (3lv. Bad effect, 3.0s)
      8 CD skill 32.0s -> 20.0s
      Ultimate skill: 120.0s -> 70.0s. Chance of deadly stunning reduced to 70-75%

      Additional information: A single bomb explodes on its own and faster and generates with a probability of 25% short stun.
      Blue:
      Range reduced to 11 cells, mana shield 30% reduction / 20% mana, speed +1.
      Next part soon

      @Lady Sky Can you pass these suggestions to Entwell? You mentioned that the players' suggestions will be taken into account.
      Grzegorz Brzęczyszczykiewicz. Chrząszczyżewoszyce powiatu Łękołody. :)

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Lou ().